From ghunt at nrao.edu  Fri Jul  6 08:49:08 2007
From: ghunt at nrao.edu (Gareth Hunt)
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 08:49:08 -0400
Subject: [comm] Fyi: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
Message-ID: <18062.14916.760108.130929@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>

Marsha and discussed this yesterday and I asked her to send me a note.
So how can we help?

In a quick bull session yesterday, several ideas were thrown around such
as requiring scientists to use a proxy for these services.

Discussion welcome.

Cheers,
Gareth.

------- start of forwarded message (RFC 934 encapsulation) -------
From: "Marsha Bishop" <mbishop at nrao.edu>
To: "Gareth Hunt Contact" <ghunt at nrao.edu>
Cc: "Dale A. Frail" <dfrail at nrao.edu>, "Tim Bastian" <tbastian at nrao.edu>,
        "Marsha Bishop" <mbishop at nrao.edu>
Subject: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 08:32:26 -0400

Gareth,

As we discussed yesterday, the Library would like, if the balance does not weigh more toward IT than the Library, to see NRAO have a single IP address for the world outside NRAO.

Just this year, we have paid over $22K for e-access to journals due to the many IP addresses at NRAO.  This is just the money.  It is now July and I am still trying to get access to some titles ("Radio Science", as an example).  I have sent over 200 e-mails, filled out over 26 licenses, and still do not have access to some items because the various journals want the physical addresses (among other information) for each IP address.  This just goes up as we try to add more and more e-content for the Library users.  

We end up paying the premium price (as if we were UVa, instead of less than 300 potential users) due to the number of IP addresses.  If NRAO had only one outside IP address, I would not have to spend hours (and to date, I have - almost 60 hours and counting) just to ensure access and argue about usage.

This has become such a burden that I have begun to ask our scientists and engineers to submit to other journals due to the problems I am having with some publishers to get a fair (and simple) connection for all of NRAO, especially those who do not have ready access to a physical Library.

So!  If this is feasible and does not cost more to do than it costs the Library, I would like to request a single "outside" IP address.

Thank you.

Marsha J. Bishop
Observatory Librarian
National Radio Astronomy Observatory
520 Edgemont Road
Charlottesville, VA? 22903
434.296.0254
434.296.0278 (fax)
www.nrao.edu/library 

------- end -------



From jrobnett at nrao.edu  Fri Jul  6 10:04:36 2007
From: jrobnett at nrao.edu (James Robnett)
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 08:04:36 -0600
Subject: [comm] Fyi: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
In-Reply-To: <18062.14916.760108.130929@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>
References: <18062.14916.760108.130929@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <9ebdc3f4fc55222f25469ed23db0b85f@aoc.nrao.edu>


     Requiring they go through the proxy is about
the only solution.

     The idea of 'one IP address' for NRAO is rather
meaningless.

     Solving this is pretty much a no-op beyond
sending an email to scistaff directing them at
the proxy howto.    We could pretty it up a bit
by having directions specific to this issue.

      There's absolutely no reason for us to be
spending that kind of money.

James

On Jul 6, 2007, at 6:49 AM, Gareth Hunt wrote:

> Marsha and discussed this yesterday and I asked her to send me a note.
> So how can we help?
>
> In a quick bull session yesterday, several ideas were thrown around 
> such
> as requiring scientists to use a proxy for these services.
>
> Discussion welcome.
>
> Cheers,
> Gareth.



From pmurphy at nrao.edu  Fri Jul  6 11:08:37 2007
From: pmurphy at nrao.edu (Patrick P Murphy)
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 11:08:37 -0400
Subject: [comm] Fyi: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
References: <18062.14916.760108.130929@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>
	<9ebdc3f4fc55222f25469ed23db0b85f@aoc.nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <18062.23285.739705.900717@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>

On Fri, 6 Jul 2007 08:04:36 -0600, James Robnett <jrobnett at nrao.edu> said:

>      Requiring they go through the proxy is about
> the only solution.

>      The idea of 'one IP address' for NRAO is rather
> meaningless.

>      Solving this is pretty much a no-op beyond
> sending an email to scistaff directing them at
> the proxy howto.    We could pretty it up a bit
> by having directions specific to this issue.

>       There's absolutely no reason for us to be
> spending that kind of money.

One idea would be to offload the process of purchase/IP-verification
from the Library to somewhere/someone else.  The only problem is there
isn't a "someone else" to my knowledge that has the time for it :-/

 - Pat


From abridle at nrao.edu  Fri Jul  6 11:31:16 2007
From: abridle at nrao.edu (Alan Bridle)
Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2007 11:31:16 -0400
Subject: [comm] Fyi: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
In-Reply-To: <9ebdc3f4fc55222f25469ed23db0b85f@aoc.nrao.edu>
References: <18062.14916.760108.130929@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>
	<9ebdc3f4fc55222f25469ed23db0b85f@aoc.nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <468E6044.1020800@nrao.edu>

All -

I think if we can really save the Library tens of thousands of dollars and
time that could then be spent on other services, we should try to.

It's understandable that publishers try to cover costs through IP-based
library subscriptions and pay-per-read web sites, whether or not IP
counting really imakes sense technically as a .usage measure

 From there on, it's just IP address gamesmanship for institutions to keep
their reader-based costs down, again whether or not that makes technical
sense.   

So I think we should experiment with getting people to use the proxy for
access to library services (explaining that this is a subscription-saving
strategy) and then see how many staff object to any awkwardness
involved.
 
In the end we will make some tradeoff between any extra awkwardness
for individual users and spending real $$ in proportion to our actual use
of the publishers' products. 

We don't want our Library or the technical publishers to go out of
business, so our community has interests on all sides of this. I think many
staff will see that a compromise is needed if it's explained to them.

A.


On 7/6/2007 10:04 AM, James Robnett wrote:
>      Requiring they go through the proxy is about
> the only solution.
>
>      The idea of 'one IP address' for NRAO is rather
> meaningless.
>
>      Solving this is pretty much a no-op beyond
> sending an email to scistaff directing them at
> the proxy howto.    We could pretty it up a bit
> by having directions specific to this issue.
>
>       There's absolutely no reason for us to be
> spending that kind of money.
>
> James
>
> On Jul 6, 2007, at 6:49 AM, Gareth Hunt wrote:
> chunls
>   
>> Marsha and discussed this yesterday and I asked her to send me a note.
>> So how can we help?
>>
>> In a quick bull session yesterday, several ideas were thrown around 
>> such
>> as requiring scientists to use a proxy for these services.
>>
>> Discussion welcome.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Gareth.
>>     
>
> _______________________________________________
> Comm mailing list
> Comm at listmgr.cv.nrao.edu
> http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/comm
>   




From pmurphy at nrao.edu  Fri Jul  6 11:46:18 2007
From: pmurphy at nrao.edu (Patrick P Murphy)
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 11:46:18 -0400
Subject: [comm] [Alma-comms] Minutes of meeting, task list
References: <18029.23170.953178.379960@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <18062.25546.131791.394549@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>

FYI... goings-on of the ALMA COMMs group.  Salient minutes extracted
with [my comments to NRAO comm group thus]:

News for the COMMS team

   * Nicolas Ovando (did I get name right? - PPM) hired as Network
     Engineer (Santiago).  [We should invite/add him to our comm list
     and possibly meetings]

   * IP Traffic prioritization when phones used at antennas: test to be
     done at AIV/OSF [concern is that phone usage will interfere with
     ALMA Software IP traffic; can we tweak the Cisco (managed) routers
     to lower the normally high QoS for VoIP?  Do we need to?]

   * Investigate cable downspouts height in AOS Computer Room...
     [concern is that ceiling too low for originally specified racks,
      2.4 meters; also concern about logistics of installation and
      maintenance on gear that high in a rack].
      * High racks originally specified to allow for enhanced airflow,
        cooling; is this a concern, given that rack-mounted units are
        typically solid on the top and bottom, with airflow going from
        front to back? 
      * Rule of thumb: half the air density, half the gear in a rack.
     [we're going to buy about 12 equipto racks imminently, for AOS]

   * Pat to think about opening up the COMMS Wiki, and only protecting
     individual topics/pages as needed [This will make it easier for
     more NRAO people to peek at what's going on in ALMA COMMS].

   * http://almasw.hq.eso.org/almasw/bin/view/SE/ALMAIPAddressing

   * http://almasw.hq.eso.org/almasw/bin/view/SE/DNSNamingConvention

 - Pat

> Greetings, all.   Please review my notes on the COMMs meeting of last
> Friday here:

>   http://almasw.hq.eso.org/almasw/bin/view/COMMs/COMMsMeeting20070608

> and check for errors, omissions, etc.  If you find any, either edit the
> wiki page yourself (and notify me) or point out the necessary change to
> me.  

> The next COMMs meeting is tentatively set for Friday, July 6, at the
> same time as last Friday's meeting (8am Mountain, 10am Eastern and
> Chilean, 4pm Garching, 11pm Mitaka).

> Here is the task list for the next meeting, sorted by first name:

>    * Christian: Investigate cable downspouts height in AOS Computer Room
>    * Christian: Take over OSF Network Diagram
>    * Pat: invite Peter Ramirez and Paola (and/or Nicolas or Justin?) to
>           the COMMs list [Done, and Stefano is our ITS guy]
>    * Pat: Create AOS Computer/Network diagram (like OSF one), hand over
>           to ChristianSaldias. 
>    * Pat: ensure EDM Computer Standards document gets updated with 4GB
>           Server standard. 
>    * Pat: Make sure there is one HardwareStandards page
>    * Pat: Send ChristianSaldias the draft list of servers etc., for high
>           altitude testing at AOS. 
>    * Pat: Continue discussion of DNSNamingConvention (and move
>           discussion to SE, not COMMS) 
>    * Pat: Ensure HardwareStandards is prominent on the SE page
>    * (Placeholder) ALL: ALMAIPAddressing (after Chile Network Guru hired
>                         ~August 1)

>  - Pat

> -- 
>  Patrick P. Murphy, Ph.D.   Senior Software Engineer, ALMA Computing IPT
>  NRAO Computing Security Manager       Head, NRAO WebAdmin Working Group
>  Home: http://goof.com/~pmurphy/     Work: http://www.nrao.edu/~pmurphy/
>   "They're not after your files, they're after your network connection"
>  -- Peter Gutmann, University of Auckland, NSF CyberSecurity Summit 2007
> _______________________________________________
> Alma-comms mailing list
> Alma-comms at listmgr.cv.nrao.edu
> http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/alma-comms


From grunion at nrao.edu  Fri Jul  6 13:47:52 2007
From: grunion at nrao.edu (Gene Runion)
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 13:47:52 -0400
Subject: [comm] [Alma-comms] Minutes of meeting, task list
Message-ID: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C482D54@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: comm-bounces at donar.cv.nrao.edu [mailto:comm-
> bounces at donar.cv.nrao.edu] On Behalf Of Patrick P Murphy
> Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 11:46 AM
> To: comm at nrao.edu
> Subject: Re: [comm] [Alma-comms] Minutes of meeting, task list
> 
> FYI... goings-on of the ALMA COMMs group.  Salient minutes extracted
> with [my comments to NRAO comm group thus]:
> 
> News for the COMMS team
> 
>    * Nicolas Ovando (did I get name right? - PPM) hired as Network
>      Engineer (Santiago).  [We should invite/add him to our comm list
>      and possibly meetings]
> 
>    * IP Traffic prioritization when phones used at antennas: test to
be
>      done at AIV/OSF [concern is that phone usage will interfere with
>      ALMA Software IP traffic; can we tweak the Cisco (managed)
routers
>      to lower the normally high QoS for VoIP?  Do we need to?]
> 

VoIP and video traffic isn't bursty, this is a key point to keep in
mind.  Assume the VoIP uses 70K bandwidth, the highest quality codec,
and you have two simultaneous calls then you are left with 1G minus 140K
of bandwidth for all other traffic.  If this results in a problem then
the whole design is extremely marginal and will not be stable.  The
amount of VoIP traffic to an antenna will be negligible and will not
interfere with other traffic; however other traffic could interfere with
VoIP if priorities aren't configured correctly.  


..clip..



From jrobnett at nrao.edu  Fri Jul  6 13:53:57 2007
From: jrobnett at nrao.edu (James Robnett)
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 11:53:57 -0600
Subject: [comm] [Alma-comms] Minutes of meeting, task list
In-Reply-To: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C482D54@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>
References: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C482D54@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <8a97a19c6b4391c274429f601d4b8d5f@aoc.nrao.edu>


    100% and wholeheartedly agree ..... I've made this point
to them here on a few occasions when they've asked me
about how we handle competition between the EVLA
M&C system and VoIP traffic.

     In short:  we don't.

james

On Jul 6, 2007, at 11:47 AM, Gene Runion wrote:

>  If this results in a problem then
> the whole design is extremely marginal and will not be stable.  The
> amount of VoIP traffic to an antenna will be negligible and will not
> interfere with other traffic; however other traffic could interfere 
> with
> VoIP if priorities aren't configured correctly.



From pmurphy at nrao.edu  Mon Jul  9 17:08:10 2007
From: pmurphy at nrao.edu (Patrick P Murphy)
Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2007 17:08:10 -0400
Subject: [comm] Revisions to Proxy page
Message-ID: <18066.41914.259788.660609@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>

I got fed up with the state of the GoldBook/Web documentation on the
proxy <http://www.nrao.edu/internal/web/proxy.shtml> so I added
SwitchProxy to it.  I haven't had time yet to document the more in-depth
use of it, e.g. how I did the ssh tunnel one (or the associated "tunnel"
shell script).  

The impetus for this was the issues with the Library needing "one IP
address" and the complaints about the proxy being hard to use.  Well,
with Firefox/SwitchProxy, it ain't hard to use once it's set up (and
it's not hard to set up either).  And I'd guesstimate[*] most of the
target audience for Library Services such as Marsha has mentioned will
have Firefox as their browser.  

Comments/suggestions for improvement of the doc solicited.  I asked Jeff
if he can grab some screen shots of the config screen for Safari; he
foolishly said yes :-)

 - Pat

[*] I've been watching stats on the web server daily for some time now
    via my webstats script.  This now gives a nice breakdown of browser
    type and percentage of use.  I'm seeing roughly 50% Firefox, 5%
    Mozilla (includes Netscape), 5% Safari, and 40% IE roughly
    speaking.  The target audience for those services is going to be
    strongly biased towards Scientists and Engineers; former will use
    Firefox or Safari almost certainly; latter will use IE or maybe
    Firefox. 

 


From grunion at nrao.edu  Mon Jul  9 18:23:25 2007
From: grunion at nrao.edu (Gene Runion)
Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2007 18:23:25 -0400
Subject: [comm] Revisions to Proxy page
Message-ID: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C483170@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>

Certainly the fees the library is paying requires serious investigation.
The minuses of the proxy
 - generates help desk tickets, just turn it off
 - doesn't easily solve assess when a person isn't directly connected to
our network, the WEB VPN works pretty good for this.  Replacing the
existing VPN, which is now obsolete, may be in order.

I still have not heard what the pricing structure is for the library
services.

-Gene


> -----Original Message-----
> From: comm-bounces at donar.cv.nrao.edu [mailto:comm-
> bounces at donar.cv.nrao.edu] On Behalf Of Patrick P Murphy
> Sent: Monday, July 09, 2007 5:08 PM
> To: webadmin at nrao.edu; comm at nrao.edu
> Subject: [comm] Revisions to Proxy page
> 
> I got fed up with the state of the GoldBook/Web documentation on the
> proxy <http://www.nrao.edu/internal/web/proxy.shtml> so I added
> SwitchProxy to it.  I haven't had time yet to document the more
in-depth
> use of it, e.g. how I did the ssh tunnel one (or the associated
"tunnel"
> shell script).
> 
> The impetus for this was the issues with the Library needing "one IP
> address" and the complaints about the proxy being hard to use.  Well,
> with Firefox/SwitchProxy, it ain't hard to use once it's set up (and
> it's not hard to set up either).  And I'd guesstimate[*] most of the
> target audience for Library Services such as Marsha has mentioned will
> have Firefox as their browser.
> 
> Comments/suggestions for improvement of the doc solicited.  I asked
Jeff
> if he can grab some screen shots of the config screen for Safari; he
> foolishly said yes :-)
> 
>  - Pat
> 
> [*] I've been watching stats on the web server daily for some time now
>     via my webstats script.  This now gives a nice breakdown of
browser
>     type and percentage of use.  I'm seeing roughly 50% Firefox, 5%
>     Mozilla (includes Netscape), 5% Safari, and 40% IE roughly
>     speaking.  The target audience for those services is going to be
>     strongly biased towards Scientists and Engineers; former will use
>     Firefox or Safari almost certainly; latter will use IE or maybe
>     Firefox.
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Comm mailing list
> Comm at listmgr.cv.nrao.edu
> http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/comm



From cclark at nrao.edu  Tue Jul 10 07:52:36 2007
From: cclark at nrao.edu (Chris Clark)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 07:52:36 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [comm] [webadmin]  Revisions to Proxy page
In-Reply-To: <46936686.1020104@nrao.edu>
References: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C483170@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>
	<46936686.1020104@nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <38527.192.33.116.9.1184068356.squirrel@webmail.gb.nrao.edu>


On Tue, July 10, 2007 06:59, Jeff Mangum wrote:
> Hi Gene,
>
> On 7/9/07 6:23 PM, Gene Runion wrote:
>> Certainly the fees the library is paying requires serious investigation.
>> The minuses of the proxy
>>  - generates help desk tickets, just turn it off
>>
> Perhaps.  If switching proxies is as slick in IE and Safari as it is in
> Firefox, then this might be a solution.

Actually switching isn't really that much of an issue. I have been using
the proxy since the service was initiated. I have yet to find a page where
it is a problem.

>>  - doesn't easily solve assess when a person isn't directly connected to
>> our network, the WEB VPN works pretty good for this.  Replacing the
>> existing VPN, which is now obsolete, may be in order.
>>
> If the webvpn is unchanged from the last time I tried it (several months
> ago), it is a non-starter.  Poor rendering of most pages in Firefox, and
> slow as molasses.

It certainly is slower from the outside than using the squid proxies but
still quite usable in my experience. The rendering in firefox certainly
can be an issue.

>> I still have not heard what the pricing structure is for the library
>> services.
>>
> In fact, this is the real question.  Need to find out from Marsha
> exactly what the pricing structure looks like.
>
> -- Jeff
>> -Gene

Chris
-- 
====================================================
    Chris Clark - Division Head, NRAO Green Bank
                 Computing Division
         An?il nathrach, ortha bh?is is beatha,
                 do ch?al d?anaimh
===================================================



From jmangum at nrao.edu  Tue Jul 10 06:59:18 2007
From: jmangum at nrao.edu (Jeff Mangum)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 06:59:18 -0400
Subject: [comm] [webadmin]  Revisions to Proxy page
In-Reply-To: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C483170@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>
References: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C483170@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <46936686.1020104@nrao.edu>

Hi Gene,

On 7/9/07 6:23 PM, Gene Runion wrote:
> Certainly the fees the library is paying requires serious investigation.
> The minuses of the proxy
>  - generates help desk tickets, just turn it off
>   
Perhaps.  If switching proxies is as slick in IE and Safari as it is in 
Firefox, then this might be a solution.
>  - doesn't easily solve assess when a person isn't directly connected to
> our network, the WEB VPN works pretty good for this.  Replacing the
> existing VPN, which is now obsolete, may be in order.
>   
If the webvpn is unchanged from the last time I tried it (several months 
ago), it is a non-starter.  Poor rendering of most pages in Firefox, and 
slow as molasses.
> I still have not heard what the pricing structure is for the library
> services.
>   
In fact, this is the real question.  Need to find out from Marsha 
exactly what the pricing structure looks like.

-- Jeff
> -Gene
>
>
>   
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: comm-bounces at donar.cv.nrao.edu [mailto:comm-
>> bounces at donar.cv.nrao.edu] On Behalf Of Patrick P Murphy
>> Sent: Monday, July 09, 2007 5:08 PM
>> To: webadmin at nrao.edu; comm at nrao.edu
>> Subject: [comm] Revisions to Proxy page
>>
>> I got fed up with the state of the GoldBook/Web documentation on the
>> proxy <http://www.nrao.edu/internal/web/proxy.shtml> so I added
>> SwitchProxy to it.  I haven't had time yet to document the more
>>     
> in-depth
>   
>> use of it, e.g. how I did the ssh tunnel one (or the associated
>>     
> "tunnel"
>   
>> shell script).
>>
>> The impetus for this was the issues with the Library needing "one IP
>> address" and the complaints about the proxy being hard to use.  Well,
>> with Firefox/SwitchProxy, it ain't hard to use once it's set up (and
>> it's not hard to set up either).  And I'd guesstimate[*] most of the
>> target audience for Library Services such as Marsha has mentioned will
>> have Firefox as their browser.
>>
>> Comments/suggestions for improvement of the doc solicited.  I asked
>>     
> Jeff
>   
>> if he can grab some screen shots of the config screen for Safari; he
>> foolishly said yes :-)
>>
>>  - Pat
>>
>> [*] I've been watching stats on the web server daily for some time now
>>     via my webstats script.  This now gives a nice breakdown of
>>     
> browser
>   
>>     type and percentage of use.  I'm seeing roughly 50% Firefox, 5%
>>     Mozilla (includes Netscape), 5% Safari, and 40% IE roughly
>>     speaking.  The target audience for those services is going to be
>>     strongly biased towards Scientists and Engineers; former will use
>>     Firefox or Safari almost certainly; latter will use IE or maybe
>>     Firefox.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Comm mailing list
>> Comm at listmgr.cv.nrao.edu
>> http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/comm
>>     
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> The Webadmin mailing list - for Apache/WebServer/Config issues
> Use the webcontent list for debate/questions about NRAO's web content, 
> and the webtechs list for, e.g. HTML, markup, scripts, cgi, php issues.
> http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/webadmin
>   
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From grunion at nrao.edu  Wed Jul 11 09:17:44 2007
From: grunion at nrao.edu (Gene Runion)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 09:17:44 -0400
Subject: [comm] Fyi: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
Message-ID: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C483523@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>

All,

 

On Tuesday I sat down with Marsha and discussed the "IP addresses" issue
and the cost basis the vendors use.  What I learned from Marsha:

*         Each vendor, as one would expect, uses different criteria for
their pricing.  Negotiating with the vendor usually results in savings.

*         Vendors consider each network a location

*         There is NOT a cost difference between a class B and class C
network

*         Most of the networks listed in the table on page
http://www.nrao.edu/internal/intranet.shtml were being provided to the
vendors.  This table, although quiet detailed, isn't appropriate for
Marsha needs.

 

Marsha and I propose the following:

*         Provide the vendors with five network numbers

o        146.88.0.0 (AOC)

o        192.33.115.0  (CV)

o        192.33.116.0  (GB)

o        192.131.232.0 (Natted range for GB and CV)

o        200.2.7.227/7 (Chile)

*         In February Marsha will review costs

 

Fallout, Changes, Action Items:

*         KP, LA, and MK VLBA sites would no longer be included.  Most
likely there is no need for access to the journals from those locations;
if there is then the WEB VPN, proxy, or Citrix server would certainly
serve their needs.

*         GB's network 199.88.192.0 would be eliminated from the list.
Hopefully this will not be a problem as people that are still on that
network could use GB's proxy.  (The long term plan is to remove hosts
from that network.)

*         Tucson's network, 206.197.219.0, would no longer be included.
The one or two users of journals in Tucson would have to use the WEB
VPN, proxy, or Citrix server.  Will they accept this?

*         I would NAT AUI's addresses to 192.131.232.x.  This would
eliminate the need to list their network with the journals.

*         I would NAT the private side of CV's VPN to 192.131.232.x;
thus eliminating the need to list that network with the journals.

*         Check with our folks in Chile that their needs are meet

 

Comments?

 

 

-Gene

 

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From jrobnett at nrao.edu  Wed Jul 11 10:06:05 2007
From: jrobnett at nrao.edu (James Robnett)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 08:06:05 -0600
Subject: [comm] Fyi: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
In-Reply-To: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C483523@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>
References: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C483523@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <ccf5cbf45986c2b234b2fafddb66f6f6@aoc.nrao.edu>


     I was curious if this was the case since it'd be more
overhead to track by host.

     What's the cost per network per vendor more or less ?
How many diffferent vendors are there ?

     As far as the plan to reduce networks it looks fine
to me.

James

On Jul 11, 2007, at 7:17 AM, Gene Runion wrote:
> ????????? Vendors consider each network a location
> ????????? There is NOT a cost difference between a class B and class C 
> network
> ?
> Comments?
> ?
> ?
> -Gene
> ?
> _______________________________________________
> Comm mailing list
> Comm at listmgr.cv.nrao.edu
> http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/comm




From grunion at nrao.edu  Wed Jul 11 14:36:16 2007
From: grunion at nrao.edu (Gene Runion)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 14:36:16 -0400
Subject: [comm] Fyi: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
Message-ID: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C4836FB@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: James Robnett [mailto:jrobnett at aoc.nrao.edu]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:06 AM
> To: Gene Runion
> Cc: comm at nrao.edu; webadmin at nrao.edu
> Subject: Re: [comm] Fyi: IP Addresses and Cost To the Library
> 
> 
>      I was curious if this was the case since it'd be more
> overhead to track by host.
> 
>      What's the cost per network per vendor more or less ?
> How many diffferent vendors are there ?
> 

Figures from Marsha-
  - 168 different vendors
  - Price range is from $790/yr to $21,679/yr
  - Because the pricing criteria used by each vendor is different a
$cost/network cannot be easily provided.

She also mentioned that changes would not take affect until January 1.


<snip>



From ghunt at nrao.edu  Tue Jul 24 13:00:01 2007
From: ghunt at nrao.edu (Gareth Hunt)
Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2007 13:00:01 -0400
Subject: [comm] Communications meeting Wednesday
Message-ID: <200707241700.l6OH01CD003963@polaris.cv.nrao.edu>

There will be a communication meeting this Wednesday at 17:30UT/13:30ET/11:30MT.

Agenda and detailed meeting locations may be found at:

  https://wiki.nrao.edu/bin/view/Ccs/CommunicationMeetingAgenda

Cheers,
Gareth.



From ghunt at nrao.edu  Wed Jul 25 08:37:32 2007
From: ghunt at nrao.edu (Gareth Hunt)
Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2007 08:37:32 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [comm] (no subject)
Message-ID: <10211.72.171.175.3.1185367052.squirrel@webmail.cv.nrao.edu>

I won't be around for the meeting today.  Unless there's something urgent,
I suggest we cancel it.

I can think of only one news item: blades for the GB and CV main switches
arrived - at least one was DOA.  Not the first time we've had problems
with North American.  Gene and Derek have more info.

Cheers,
Gareth.




From cclark at nrao.edu  Wed Jul 25 08:42:09 2007
From: cclark at nrao.edu (Chris Clark)
Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2007 08:42:09 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [comm] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <10211.72.171.175.3.1185367052.squirrel@webmail.cv.nrao.edu>
References: <10211.72.171.175.3.1185367052.squirrel@webmail.cv.nrao.edu>
Message-ID: <60100.192.33.116.9.1185367329.squirrel@webmail.gb.nrao.edu>

Gene & Derek,

Perhaps we could still meet to discuss the GBT upgrade?

I've put together a wiki page at

       https://wiki.nrao.edu/bin/view/GB/ServoRoom

Chris


On Wed, July 25, 2007 08:37, Gareth Hunt wrote:
> I won't be around for the meeting today.  Unless there's something urgent,
> I suggest we cancel it.
>
> I can think of only one news item: blades for the GB and CV main switches
> arrived - at least one was DOA.  Not the first time we've had problems
> with North American.  Gene and Derek have more info.
>
> Cheers,
> Gareth.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Comm mailing list
> Comm at listmgr.cv.nrao.edu
> http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/comm
>


-- 
====================================================
    Chris Clark - Division Head, NRAO Green Bank
                 Computing Division
          My heart has joined the thousand
         for today my friend stopped running
===================================================



From grunion at nrao.edu  Wed Jul 25 09:45:43 2007
From: grunion at nrao.edu (Gene Runion)
Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2007 09:45:43 -0400
Subject: [comm] (no subject)
Message-ID: <0BE4451641015645AF36884947C2711C569512@cv-er-xsa.ad.nrao.edu>

Chris,

I will see you at meeting to discuss GBT upgrade.

-Gene


> -----Original Message-----
> From: comm-bounces at donar.cv.nrao.edu [mailto:comm-
> bounces at donar.cv.nrao.edu] On Behalf Of Chris Clark
> Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 8:42 AM
> To: Gareth Hunt Contact
> Cc: comm at nrao.edu
> Subject: Re: [comm] (no subject)
> 
> Gene & Derek,
> 
> Perhaps we could still meet to discuss the GBT upgrade?
> 
> I've put together a wiki page at
> 
>        https://wiki.nrao.edu/bin/view/GB/ServoRoom
> 
> Chris
> 
> 
> On Wed, July 25, 2007 08:37, Gareth Hunt wrote:
> > I won't be around for the meeting today.  Unless there's something
> urgent,
> > I suggest we cancel it.
> >
> > I can think of only one news item: blades for the GB and CV main
> switches
> > arrived - at least one was DOA.  Not the first time we've had
problems
> > with North American.  Gene and Derek have more info.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Gareth.
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Comm mailing list
> > Comm at listmgr.cv.nrao.edu
> > http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/comm
> >
> 
> 
> --
> ====================================================
>     Chris Clark - Division Head, NRAO Green Bank
>                  Computing Division
>           My heart has joined the thousand
>          for today my friend stopped running
> ===================================================
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Comm mailing list
> Comm at listmgr.cv.nrao.edu
> http://listmgr.cv.nrao.edu/mailman/listinfo/comm